He was at most 21 and you can perhaps younger than when his daughter Joanna came to be. She might was the brand new eldest of all of the children the guy fathered from the his various mistresses.

John grew up in December 1167

1187 June - John inside France when Chateauroux was being besieged 1187 June 23 - truce 1188 Jan. 29 - Henry yields to England, perhaps having John into the tow 1188 Summer - Henry directs John back to , crosses out of 1189 June twelve - John within Le Mans whenever disarmed of the Henry's order, and then John fled otherwise try contributed out for safety 1189 July 6 - Henry We becomes deceased inside France 1189 Aug. several - Richard will bring John back again to The united kingdomt having him 1189 Aug. 31 - John hitched to Isabelle regarding Gloucester within Marlebridge 1189 September. 3 - Richard crowned from the Westminster Abbey 1189 October. - Richard delivers John on Wales in order to subdue brand new edgy Welsh 1190 Feb. - John summoned to help you and you can pressed on the oath not to ever set base to the The united kingdomt for three age 1190 Summer - Richard continues on campaign [John vacations his oath] For the intentions, it’s believed that initial several months, therefore the really likely time for Joanna to own started developed, is the 1187-nine several months. 1187 - John uses almost the season from inside the France 1188 - John could have gone back to The united kingdomt in the January, but of the summer is sent back again to France, in which the guy seems to have remained 1189 Kosta Rika kadД±nlar - John seems to be within the France January - August, going back so you can The united kingdomt into the August in preparation to possess his relationships to the 30 Aug. In the event that John produced no more unrecorded output so you can England, it would appear that the guy spent on 80% out-of his go out off January 1187 up until their marriage, in France . He was will eventually because of the State away from Mortain, inside (before Richard's coronation).

The above mentioned pointers, because of the period plus the simple fact that Joanna try introduced so you're able to The united kingdomt out-of France from inside the 1203 for their own relationship so you're able to Llywelyn, lends credence on indisputable fact that Joanna along with her mother had been of French/Norman resource.

Considering plus John's well-known philandering during this time period, indeed there is apparently many candidates on the part off mommy away from Joanna!

My earlier in the day blog post offered all the information one to Paget indicated that they was Clemence de- Dauntsey, which hitched Nicholas de- Verdun. I considered that it was the Nicholas and you will Clementia to which Henry 111 offered new infant custody away from Susanna (while the good hostage) in the 1228. After another type of a lot of time research but not, I can discover zero shade out of a good Clemence de- Dauntsey within the the newest information. I did so look for although not, the fresh new opinion of 1 genealogist who obviously stated it…’ I think we (the newest genealogists) established that there try no like individual since Clemence de Dauntsey. That personality of the partner out-of Nicholas de Verdun is actually an excellent blunder because of the Paget!’

I’m prepared to accept that completion, just like the next studies of the ideas of your 2nd Clemence proved far more productive.

Normandy

Clemence le Boteler came into this world throughout the 1175 inside Steeple Lavington, Wiltshire. Their own father are Philip ce Boteler (produced circa 1150).

Clemence ce Boteler partnered Nicholas de- Verdun into the 1202 (his second partner shortly after their wedding to Joan Fitz Piers. Mention, it matrimony is not confirmed) during the Alton, Staffordshire and got one youngster, Rohese de- Verdun who was created during the 1203 otherwise 1205 (died. Feb 1247).

If the, in fact, Joanna was the consequence of a good liaison between John and you may Clemence ce Boteler (who does was old as much as fourteen-15 at the time), it might was basically very hard toward Ce Boteler nearest and dearest to obtain a suitable partner to have Clemence. In fact specific a decade solution before a great ily?) with a trusting English nobleman and you can assets holder, Nicholas de Verdun. Making out for now the possibility that Nicholas got fallen crazy about this new twenty seven year-old Clemence and you may wished to marry their own, it might was basically necessary for John to include Clemence which have some possessions regarding her very own in order for she turned an even more glamorous award to have their husband to be.